26/03/10
LONDON (West)
We've been told that there's a nasty outbreak in the Ealing area of West London - we quote:
"In Ealing, West London, where I live we have a number of regular long established meetings at 7.30 in the evening. Now we find the numbers at these meetings are falling because other new meetings are being opened nearby, but at 6.00. This "other AA" is centred around one individual - he even prints up his own literature on pink cards with the "six suggestions" and all his meeting times.
"In Ealing, West London, where I live we have a number of regular long established meetings at 7.30 in the evening. Now we find the numbers at these meetings are falling because other new meetings are being opened nearby, but at 6.00. This "other AA" is centred around one individual - he even prints up his own literature on pink cards with the "six suggestions" and all his meeting times.
I don't know what to do about all this - it's like there's two AA's in Ealing. It just creates division where there should be unity. I went along to one or two of "their" meetings and there were people there I had never ever seen before, even though I have been in recovery for nearly five years. These people would never dream of coming to one of our meetings."
29/01/10
VAUXHALL: LONDON BEGINNERS
The latest addition to our Cult: Where to Find
Area: GREATER LONDON
Town: VAUXHALL
Day: THURSDAY
Postcode: SW8
Time: 19.00
Group Name: VAUXHALL: LONDON BEGINNERS
Open or Closed: All mtgs 'open'.
Address: Ashmole Community Hall, 2 Meadow Rd SW8 1QB
Town: VAUXHALL
Day: THURSDAY
Postcode: SW8
Time: 19.00
Group Name: VAUXHALL: LONDON BEGINNERS
Open or Closed: All mtgs 'open'.
Address: Ashmole Community Hall, 2 Meadow Rd SW8 1QB
This group is up to its old tricks again - yet another promotional event featuring named guest speakers and with a £7.00 charge for the privilege of listening to some "personalities" recycling the latest perversion of the AA message. The colourful, if not garish, flyer (see above) promoting this event helpfully points out that:
"There are many AA conferences/conventions held around the world. A common misconception of these gatherings is that they are regular AA Meetings. Conventions and Conferences are special events, which require a substantial amount of funding. This convention is self-supporting. Attendance is voluntary and as responsible AA members, we pay our own way".
Apparently this rationale is intended to justify charging for entry. Well they've got one thing right - this little shindig can by no stretch of the imagination be considered a "regular AA meeting" if an AA meeting at all! Again an attempt is made to blur the lines between what constitutes an AA meeting and what might be considered a business meeting or a purely social event. There is nothing to suggest in the promotional material that members are not in fact being charged to go to a meeting. In AA conventions there is a clear separation between the two, the cost of running the AA meeting met by "voluntary contributions" and any other charges (relating to the provision of entertainment, food, beverages etc) being separately itemised, and comprising a ticket price. In this fashion no AA member is excluded from attending an AA meeting per se for whatever financial reason. It is open then for each person to decide whether they wish to attend any accessory activities but these latter fall within the province of "outside issues" and therefore subject to the usual economic constraints.
Just for the hell of it we've listed the AA traditions this group has broken (and this purely on the basis of the flyer):
One, Two, Four, Five, Six, Seven, Ten, Eleven, Twelve
Not bad! Only 9 traditions out of 12 - must try harder!
Cheers
The Fellas
(our thanks to the AA member who drew our attention to this)
PS The good news - apparently attendance at this event is "voluntary" - Phew! What a relief!
24/09/09
Cult activity in South East London Intergroup Area (West)
An AA member has kindly sent us photos of a flier which was recently being distributed in AA meetings in this part of London. This advertising material would seem to emanate from a group recently established (July 2009) in the Kennington/Oval area on a Thursday evening (London Beginners Group). The event was not sponsored by the local AA groups nor by SELIG. Local members have challenged their attempts to advertise this non-AA event in AA meetings. In one instance a cult member was asked if the event was "AA approved". The fellow did not seem to understand the concept so it was explained to him: "Is this event put on by AA, approved by Intergroup [according to AA guidelines], with monies collected going back through Intergroup and into the service structure of AA?" Apparently the chap in question was unable to furnish an adequate reply and beat a hasty retreat. There have also been attempts by cult members to intervene in local groups by asking for group consciences to be held (a tactic by which they seek to incorporate their agenda into that of AA) - so far these have proven to be unsuccessful. SELIG contacted the organiser of this event and invited him to attend the next Intergroup business meeting (July 09) to offer an explanation, an invitation which was initially accepted but then subsequently declined. SELIG minutes indicate that these events 'should not be announced in AA meetings' since they have nothing to do with AA.
It will be observed from the flier that if it were sponsored by AA or an AA group it would be in breach of the following Traditions:
Trad 1: Acting without consultation with AA groups and thereby causing disunity
Trad 3: Charging for admission to event - financial status is not a requirement for membership (or attendance at any AA event)
Trad 4: Their conduct is adversely affecting other groups and AA as a whole
Trad 6: This group is endorsing an outside organisation viz. Emotional Sobriety
Trad 7: Event open to non AA members and accepting payments from these
Trad 8: It is unclear how the revenue collected from this event is disbursed - it is indicated that some of the speakers come from the US (Are they here in a professional capacity? Are they being paid expenses and/or fees? Is this a justifiable cost? For the last we think not - no one's that sober!)
Trad 11: Flier is promotional
Trad 12: Part of the promotional content includes reference to specific personalities
The flier carries misinformation relating to the financing of this workshop - an AA meeting is ANY occasion where two or more members of AA (that is someone who has a desire to stop drinking and declares themselves to be such) meet to share their experience, strength and hope so that they may help each other to get and stay sober - the ENTIRE business of AA is precisely that. If a meeting is being run for any other purpose it is NOT an AA meeting. Workshops, conferences, business meetings, however they may be labelled, are ALL AA meetings and ANY member of AA is entitled to attend them, and without financial charge. Any costs incurred should be borne by the Fellowship (either locally or as a whole) from VOLUNTARY contributions received.
Some research into one of the speakers indicates a connection with a non-AA website. (The site carries the usual disclaimer of non-affiliation. It is clear however from the circulated flier that the speaker is using this event to promote his own agenda (which we repeat, and according to the site's own disclaimer, has no association with Alcoholics Anonymous).
Clearly how an individual earns his living, or occupies his time, is entirely his own affair, but AA is not the place to tout for business.
Our thanks to the member who drew our attention to this.
Cheers
The Fellas
23/09/09
The cult in London - a bit more history
As mentioned elsewhere on this site the cult have been active in London for some considerable time, initially under the "guidance" of David B (now deceased) and subsequently David C. Various attempts have been made to subvert the service structure of AA in the metropolis, to replace it with one more amenable to the cult agenda. Opposition to their activities may account for the demise of the Eaton Square axis - they found that they could get nowhere and opted to send out "missionaries" to weaker and more unaware areas - viz. Kent - which is currently suffering from a serious infestation of their members and groups (see Cult: Where to Find). On the death of David B David C assumed the vacated position and attempted to secure the two London regions to the cult. He failed in this instance due to effective opposition but it should not be assumed that if that battle was lost the war is over. Indeed this campaign was preceded by one in the 90s where David C similarly sought to gain dominance in the (at that time) monolithic London region. Finally they failed simply because the cult groups' 30-40 GSRs were insufficient to justify their control over a part of the service structure that some 500 AA groups were simply ignoring - this is what is called "group power". But their ambitions remain consistent - to gain control of AA in London and effectively separate it from the rest of the UK - "divide and rule" is the strategy.
Be aware!
Regards
The Fellas
17/08/09
A bit of history - the London/Plymouth connection
"David B [one of the founders of the cult movement within AA] a number of years ago wanted to be elected to the GSB [General Service Board]. They had other ideas and was refused - he sulked - the following year ( 1995 or thereabouts) the GSB were involved in forming a new constitution relating to the application of the concepts in this country. They made some errors and subsequently rectified them and apologised (Step 10). David B's gang seized upon this and started a campaign down in the South West to try and get a vote of no confidence in the GSB. They wanted the Board to be removed. People in the area were resistant to the notion and refused to back the campaign. Their region refused the proposal and in fact made a vote of confidence in the board. This movement was led by the Chelsea intergroup (David B's patch). Then followed a dirty tricks campaign which involved people's anonymity being broken (eg letters being sent to members' homes with the AA logo on the outside of the envelope. They still had no impact. I believe that these events are the impetus behind the current Taliban campaign. They failed to achieve their ends and so they are seeking to subvert AA via the current methods. This could further show that there is a deliberate strategy to take over AA by these thugs....."
....which brings us back to Little Wayne. The word is that he's discovered IT'S COLD OUT THERE - and is panicking about his and the cult's move to form a separate Intergroup. Apparently a reconciliation is in the offing and noises are being made about the cult rejoining (ie taking over) Plymouth Intergroup again. Our prediction is that Tradition One will be much bandied about, the cult will go into all out "victim mode" and play the part for all its worth, and AA will repeat the same old mistakes (remember the AA definition of insanity!!) and allow them back into the fold, where they will continue to inflict as much damage on AA as they can in pursuit of their own agenda (some groups (and members) never learn). But IT IS worth remembering that the cult groups have identifiable connections with non-AA organisations (in breach of the Traditions) - much of their literature is derived from these sources (as is their programme), some have connections to commercial interests (in some instances advertising their wares on their websites)(in breach of the Traditions), none of them even have a nodding acquaintance with the recovery programme of Alcoholics Anonymous (ie. the one in the Big Book) and they are run by a core group of individuals whose primary interests certainly are not those of AA but rather their own self aggrandisement (sponsorship idolatry, circuit speakers ("big fish in little ponds"), local gurus etc) (in breach of the Traditions). Still at least one good thing will come out of all of this - we'll be able to say "WE TOLD YOU SO!!" - Every cloud has a....
Over to you
Cheerio
The Fellas
PS We'll be producing a cult "Where to Find" shortly (including a star rating) which we hope will prove invaluable in ensuring that their members don't wander into AA meetings by accident - and more importantly AA members (and most importantly newcomers) don't have to endure cult propaganda a moment longer than is absolutely necessary. We can't take all the credit for this innovation - the cult groups (both here and in the US) have been producing their own "Where to Finds" for some time now.
11/08/09
North London Region - Who says the cult is a threat!
A contribution from an AA member interested in shaking the "apathy of London members who shrug when told that the Visionaries are taking over their Fellowship" (dates should be adjusted by about two years to account for delay in publication)
"They've [variously known as the "cult", "Visions", "Taliban", "Step Nazis" etc] got a tenuous hold of the whole of London Region (North), the biggest Region in the country, via a simple and clever manoeuvre disguised as "democracy" -- they got Region to vote 3 years ago for an annual combined meeting of GSRs in all eleven intergroups, to take place on the first Sunday in November and "confirm" Region officers and Conference Delegates. The second year this "Region Assembly" voted itself the power to declare Region policies... last year they voted for their intergroups to send their money to region rather than GSO... and next month they've got resolutions about taking over the London Where To Find and filling it with their literature. There are 450 meetings in these eleven intergroups and about half of them have GSRs, but of course most of the active ones attend their intergroups for Service matters, thus only 40-50 die-hards show up at this Assembly. Guess how many Visionary GSRs are three-line-whipped into going and voting as a bloc? About 30. This is the Fellowship of AA in a nutshell. You only have to organise between five and ten percent of members at any level to control that level.... which is OK if you're picking a tea maker for your group, but dangerous when the decision is whether a meetings-list for newcomers should include instructions to drunken members of the public to get down on their knees."
Any further information on developments in North London (or any other part of the country) would be welcome (and published subsequent to our corroboration procedures)
PS Update on Our Little Twitterer: The poor fellow is still tweeting away - and still providing us with more publicity - but he's getting quite desperate by the sounds of it - abuse levels rising with each successive Tweet - a sure sign of a lost argument - ah bless!
8/08/09
How the cult proliferates
"The Wednesday Eaton Square "Visions for You" meeting transmuted into a Thursday Cardinal Hume Centre Westminster meeting about two years ago [2006]. Food was even served after the meeting where newcomers were 'made at home' though men and women were strictly segregated. This meeting then folded about 6 months ago [2007] supposedly on the grounds that there was insufficient interest but actually due to a nasty power struggle."
The above (sent in by a member) is an example of how the cult proliferates - not by consensus, but by power struggles within its own ranks, each faction seeking to outdo the others in terms of its "purity" of message. It is in this manner that it proceeds towards the ever more extreme poles of fanaticism and dogmatism, driven not by a desire to help the still suffering alcoholic but impelled only by ego-dominated power struggles - or as it puts it so simply in the Big Book - "self-will run riot".
5/08/09
A member's eye view
"Greetings
Nice to see a movement against these rather empty evil people - the Joys and their other manifestations. I was aware of them and their practices for many years in London...there was a period when myself and 2 or 3 friends used to visit the Joys meeting on Ifield Road on Sunday evening, hoping that our sharing might intrude on the psychological closed shop they were then. I also tried to get intergroup to do something about them..perhaps 15 years ago...It worried me greatly that a journalist might infiltrate one of their groups and it would not take long to recognise all the signs of a cult therein...lovebombing, cutting off from friends, staying within the circle, etc etc. (As happened in Washington about 12 months back - made a big article in Newsweek or perhaps Time magazine (not sure which, one of them no longer functions).
I got sober with David B [one of the originators of the cult movement in Great Britain] - we were both members of the Milman's Street meeting, in Worlds End Chelsea...he came in 2 years before me...to hear him talk you would think he had 12 stepped Bill W - I always actively opposed most things he proposed..because they were daft...I remember him turning up once at a Regional Meeting in Central London and his contribution was so daft that it was ignored and we moved on the the next issue. He never came again..couldn't hack working with grown-ups."
13/07/09
London area
We've had a couple of separate reports of meetings of dubious provenance - details as follows:
"There is a Visions for you meeting on Tuesday night, Ormond road, Richmond [Surrey], I had the pleasure of running into one particular gentleman (and yes I am a young female..) needless to say I have not attended for some time once I realised what was going on. My brother also witnessed the difficulties faced in Kent and warned me off".
Also:
W8 Notting Hill: Friday Road to Recovery (A Vision for You) 7.30pm
As time proceeds we shall be compiling a list of confirmed cult meetings throughout the country - hopefully this will serve as a handy alternative "Where to Find" directing cult members away from AA groups - and preventing AA members (and most importantly newcomers) from ending up in cult meetings.
PS It appears that Whitstable (Wednesday) [Kent] has come down with a bad case of "swine" flu - the secretary seems to have developed the symptoms which manifest in a form of delirium - inviting cult members to do chairs at the meeting etc. Tankerton and Strood carriers may have introduced this unfortunate virus to the group - we suggest a rigorously enforced quarantine to extirpate the infection. Similarly Herne Bay (Sunday) also shows signs of the malaise - similar prophylactic precautions are suggested.
24/06/09
The Design for Living AA Group - Wimbledon
Quote:
"I am an AA member of 18 months now, admittedly a relative newcomer- and have been following your site for a while. I do not know if they are affiliated to other 'cults' (I do not think so) but this design for living group - started by 'Dorothy' in Wimbledon has been raising concerns locally for some time.
I won't give specifics at this time as the examples come from other people; but is all the 'cult' stuff- getting phone no's, advising on medication/sexuality, a huge emphasis in the meeting on the home group, business cards for the meeting, sending 'promoters' to other meetings to tout newcomers, secretary is 'on a stage' in the meeting to elude superiority, own website, etc. Dorothy herself goes to no other AA meetings that I have seen- only her own. She continues to be secretary of her own group. Oh, and they advise on amounts of money for tradition 7 'notes please if you are working’. Probably to pay for all the non-AA literature they have - albeit 'on a different table'
People are talking all over AA in the Wimbledon are about how this is not right. However, as has happened elsewhere, there is an apathy and resistance to do anything of difference.
In AA in general in Wimbledon; there seems to be an increase in very dictatorial advice and 'possessive behaviour' around newcomers - poor boundaries being exercised and inappropriate questions asked of other members esp. newcomers: Whether this has any link to Design for Living or any other cult group I do not know.
What I do know though, is there is something not going right in many of the Wimbledon meetings; myself and other AA members I know of now avoiding them as far as possible.
Maybe in the other meetings it's nothing sinister- just apathy, unhealthy gossip and poor boundaries amongst many members.
Design for living though, definitely has another agenda aside from that of AA. I would be grateful if you would give your views on the site/draw people's attention to the matter.
Thank you for all your hard work in keeping AA safe.
Regards"
We then asked for some clarification on some of the points made by the correspondent:
"Thanks so much for your reply.
When I say advising on sexuality - I mean she was advising a gay sponsee to 'go straight'...however, I am sure she has more opinions on relationships within AA though I haven't heard them.
The business cards- they are specifically for that meeting, inviting people to attend with time, dates etc- I used to have one. I caught one of her cronies a while back giving one of these cards to a newcomer at the Friday night Wimbledon newcomers meeting- luckily the newcomer saw straight through it.
Yes I also agree homegroups are beneficial in general. What happened to me with Design for Living- was that I actually went to the first ever meeting.
I was about 4 months sober at the time. The MOMENT I walked through the door, Dorothy pounced on me and asked me for my phone number, saying 'I want this meeting to be a homegroup- I want to be able to ring you and see if you are alright if you don't turn up one week'. She was doing this to everyone who turned up, and writing all the numbers in a book.
Granted: this was a year ago, so I don't know if she's still doing that. And I have to admit she never rang- maybe because I made a point of telling her that I was moving out of Colliers Wood (where the meeting was before she moved it to south Wimbledon) the very next week, and therefore would not be making it my home group.
I did give her my number though (which I have since changed). When I was a newcomer, I didn't have the ability to say no to anything or anyone, my head was shot to pieces!
Am glad to say have now learned to exercise a bit of judgement in and out of AA."
The Design for Living group runs its own website on which it uses the following disclaimer:
“The Design for Living AA Group.co.uk has neither been approved or endorsed by and is not affiliated with Alcoholics Anonymous World Services, Inc. or any AA Service entity of any country.” In other words this is NOT an AA website.
Comment: No one is under any obligation to hand over their telephone number to someone that they don't know – so just say “No”. AA does not offer any advice on medication – we're not qualified to do so, and it is an “outside issue”. AA does not offer any advice on sexual orientation (which, by the way, is a complete irrelevancy when it comes to getting and staying sober), and is also an “outside issue”. AA groups do NOT promote themselves with the use of business cards, fliers etc. If a group is doing so then it is in clear breach of Tradition Four and our advice is give it a very wide berth. AA groups do not send “promoters” to other groups – if a group is doing so it is in breach of Tradition Four (see advice above). There are no dues or fees for AA membership and therefore any “suggestion” as to how much one should put in the pot may safely be disregarded. The treasurer may remind the group from time to time of the economic realities of life – after that it is up to the group members to make their own decisions on how much to put in the collection. AA is not a commercial organisation bent on making a profit and indeed runs on the principle that any accumulation of wealth or property would be inimical to our spiritual welfare. In a sense it could be said that we have taken a “vow of collective poverty”.
The best course of action when dealing with such controlling groups is:
- choose not to support or attend them;
- make newcomers aware of what AA actually stands for and indicate the ways in which these groups break AA traditions. It does not seem to be necessary to advise them not to attend these controlling groups once they have been put in the picture – newcomers are not stupid and just need to be given sufficient information to counter the propaganda put out by the cult groups as a corrective to the distorted message of AA that they carry;
- Be prepared to challenge their group members if they try to “poach” newcomers from AA meetings. Many groups have made it clear already that such “bullying” conduct will not be tolerated. Cult members tend to target groups with weak "group consciences”, and equally they tend to avoid groups that have agreed clearly defined responses to their invasive behaviour. If it is made clear to them that they are welcome to attend any AA meeting so long as they have a desire to stop drinking but that any unacceptable conduct will result in them being asked to leave the meeting they get the message quickly and take their business elsewhere;
- As rapidly as possible draw the attention of newcomers to the basic text of AA – the Big Book, and invite them to familiarise themselves with its contents. They will rapidly discover for themselves what AA is and is not about. They will see there that they are under NO OBLIGATION to do ANYTHING if they so choose. They are NOT OBLIGED to go through the programme, they are NOT OBLIGED to get a sponsor (indeed sponsorship is not mentioned once in the basic text) nor to do exactly what this sponsor says etc. The best defence available to someone new to AA against the predations of cult members is a thorough grounding in this text and an exposure to the genuine programme as opposed to the semi digested and mangled versions propagated by the cult.
23/05/09
A couple of items: Westway Intergroup and Euston Friday
Westway Intergroup
"Like your site so just thought I'd drop you a line. Am an ordinary bog standard AA member from West London with 14 years sobriety. Just a couple of snippets for you to watch out for. Have heard that the Westway Intergroup has largely now been taken over by the Road to Recovery people who have taken a lot of the service positions. Given the nature of Westway members (covers Notting Hill, Ladbroke Grove, Acton, Shepherds Bush) nobody has really noticed mainly due to a laziness of the general AA member (myself included) to go to intergroup.
Have also heard of a worrying new cult group in the US called Acts of recovery. This is where the cult leader gets vulnerable newcomers to do their step 5 in front of the "Group". Apparently the Oxford Group used to do this sort of stuff in the early days. Let's hope this sinister type of group doesn't cross the Atlantic"
Euston Friday
"After reading your website I would like to let you know of a couple of points mentioned which I have seen in practice.
I am a newcomer (March 2009) and have attended the 7.30pm Friday Euston: how it works. At this meeting they offer hot food after each meeting. They also discussed in group conscience producing a laminated card which included things like do a gratitute list and also call a newcomer twice a week. This suggestion was quite forcefully promoted by a member who I know attends 'vision for you'. When someone queried if it was conference approved he said no but it wasn't conference disapproved either."
I am a newcomer (March 2009) and have attended the 7.30pm Friday Euston: how it works. At this meeting they offer hot food after each meeting. They also discussed in group conscience producing a laminated card which included things like do a gratitute list and also call a newcomer twice a week. This suggestion was quite forcefully promoted by a member who I know attends 'vision for you'. When someone queried if it was conference approved he said no but it wasn't conference disapproved either."
Any more information on these would be welcome
Cheers
16/04/09
Winchmore Hill (North London) meetings
An AA member has drawn our attention to the activities of the two Winchmore Hill meetings. Apparently the Monday meeting has a new secretary who has been described as "very much a Primary purpose guy and the power behind the Winchmore Hill Friday Beginners' Meeting". Apparently the two groups are supposed to be separate - and therefore separately self-supporting (see Traditions Four and Seven) - but the Monday group has been financially propping up the Friday group since it was started - not, apparently, to universal approbation. It seems that there is no attempt to interfere with members' use of prescription medication (as yet!) but the sponsorship style is the usual cult "do what I tell you" method of presenting whatever recovery programme is the latest in fashion (mostly some kind of hybrid Big Book stuff imported from the US). Apparently the new secretary's ambition is to "put the meeting to rights". He has close connections with the "Barking Taliban and Sidcup" (a local reference from down that way, which rather colourfully describes indigenous sentiments towards this gang's efforts to carry whatever current weirdness poses as the programme of AA. We're further informed that the secretary's election was predominantly due to a combination of "apathy, fence sitting plus the attendance of all his sponsees". So there you go - if a group isn't autonomous, doesn't have a sense of its own identity, and doesn't know the Traditions, isn't conversant with the AA booklet, "The AA Group" or even the guidelines in the handbook - then it's up for grabs - and it will become a personality driven entity as are most of the cult groups. So in the interests of furthering the educational process we have, at absolutely no expense, located a downloadable version of "The AA group" (US version) for your perusal (click here for pdf download). We could refer you to the relevant sections in the booklet but we're not going to - Ah! Cruel world! - but as they say, "It works, if you work it!
Cheerio
and happy reading
The Fellas
6/03/09
More on the Design for Living Group South Wimbledon
Email correspondence:
Subject: Design for Living Group South WImbledon
To: aacultwatch
Date: Friday, 27 February, 2009, 12:08 AM
To: aacultwatch
Date: Friday, 27 February, 2009, 12:08 AM
"I have been to this group and totally agree with the STOP PRESS article. The person concerned has DESTROYED lives and I believe is operating a cult under the disguise of AA. She literally brainwashes people. A lot of us have felt it is not AA but how on earth did it get into the Where to Find. This has to be stopped. It is NOT AA."
Our reply:
"Hi .....
Thank you for your email. We have relatively little information about this particular group and only came across it when one of the cultwatch team was browsing the web and came across their site. It rang a few warning bells and we then contacted them (the results are displayed in the Stop Press). We would be interested in any more details that you might (or anyone else) have on this group if you would care to provide them. Specific incidents are useful since they give a more concrete sense of the group's activities and act as both a warning to other members, and a potential deterrent to that group. We have been quite successful in placing pressure on such groups as these to desist - or apparently desist - from some of their more extreme behaviour. Finally the only people who can actually do anything about this problem are you and us. There is no body in AA that can take action against such conduct
Regards
The Fellas"
"Hi there,
I have only been once. There are a few examples - they have their own just for today card by the teas, with strange things like Just for Today I will be quiet in the meeting, not use mobiles etc. etc.. They spent a fortune on literature - both AA and non AA. They often hand out their own leaflets at the meeting - almost like worksheets. She also gets people's telephone numbers and writes them all in a book - when my friend asked why she said 'in case you don't turn up next week'. The meeting used to reside at Colliers Wood but now has moved to a venue with a stage and the secretary and chair sit up on a stage which is fine in principle, however, the secretary picks on vulnerable people to share. I was at one where a newcomer was in pieces and did not want to share but they were almost insistent the newcomer did. She ended up in tears. The person who started the meeting up interrupts sharing, cross shares, stands up in meetings and tells people they shouldn't share that. She tells people not to take antidepressants. Apparently this particularly person and her sidekick have been around many years and every so often pop up and try and start up a controversial meeting. The persons concerned come across as very well meaning but I know from a lot of oldtimers and poor newcomers that I had contact with her or her meetings have had their lives destroyed. One might say this person is a wolf in sheep's clothing.
..........
Many thanks
Regards"
Additionally our researches show that this group uses Google Adwords to advertise its website (the group website, not the AA website) in the London area. This is a "pay per click" system of marketing. So someone, somewhere has to pay for this?? This constitutes group promotion and in our view breaks a number of AA traditions.
08/02/09
The Design For Living Group of Alcoholics Anonymous?? South Wimbledon
Below some recent email correspondence between aacultwatch and the above mentioned group.
Our email:
Name: aacultwatch
Subject: links to non AA sites
-------------------------QUERY-----------------------------
You carry links to organisations that have nothing to do with Alcoholics Anonymous. Are you are aware of the Traditions relating to non-endorsement and non-affiliation with outside organisations. Similarly you carry advertising for commercial products? If you are an AA group why is it that you are breaking those Traditions?
Their response:
Thanks I pay no heed to your emails. If you get some satisfaction from
continuing your self appointed task feel free ... in fellowship
continuing your self appointed task feel free ... in fellowship
----- Original Message -----
From: "aacultwatch" To:
Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 7:23 AM
Subject: links to non AA sites
Comment:
Well that's got to be one of the fastest group consciences we've ever seen. Must be a one man (or woman) show!!
However, we would question the necessity for any AA group (if this is in fact an AA group) to run websites promoting themselves (and certainly not endorsing any one else, either explicitly or by implication). A full listing of AA meetings is available via the Alcoholics Anonymous website. Additionally, 'Where to Finds' can usually be acquired quite easily at most AA meetings, which include sufficient information for the newcomer to find their way around.
Additionally, the provision of non-conference approved literature by this group (following a bizarre guideline adopted by the General Service Conference allowing pretty well anything to be put on display at an AA meetings – see Debbie Does Dallas) means that the newcomer now has the rare treat of being offered views, albeit in print, that may not have any connection with the recovery programme of AA (as indicated in the book Alcoholics Anonymous). The distinction between conference approved and non-conference approved literature will, we think, be a rather fine one and totally lost on someone new to the Fellowship.
Finally - there is a disclaimer at the bottom of the site webpage to the effect that:
“The Design for Living AA Group.co.uk has neither been approved or endorsed by and is not affiliated with Alcoholics Anonymous World Services, Inc. or any AA Service entity of any country.”
This is displayed in very small print and all but invisible against the background colour of the page. However the header uses the AA logo and refers to it being an AA group. So it would seem that the website has nothing to do with AA yet promotes an AA group. Clever eh!!
Cheers
The Fellas
PS That bit in the email "..... in fellowship" - Nah! We're not convinced
17/12/08
More news from down Clapham way
“The Tuesday Evening Clapham meeting, if this is the one referred to as 'Battersea Beginners' as I think it may be it would say it’s a safe bet that it’s a 'Joys' meeting. I went to this meeting a few times as a friend who was relatively new to the fellowship had told me they were going there. In my experience, they do not allow newcomers to share until they have completed step 5! There is a very heavy pressure to have a sponsor from 'their' meeting and to strictly follow the 'card' of daily suggestions. I found it greatly disturbing, as this friend of mine is agoraphobic and thus found it very, very difficult to go to even one meeting a week. There seemed to be no compassion or understanding of this and a lot of pressure was placed upon this friend in the fellowship to get to 'their meetings' which included places such as the Oval. Another thing that made me uneasy was that this friend was being evicted from their flat as the landlord had sold the property, and as such had no alternative but to find a new place to live and yet members of this meeting placed great pressure upon this newcomer 'not to make any decisions in the first year' and suggested that they 'hand it over to god!!!' thank god their higher power placed friends like myself and others like me in this person’s path to help this person go to the homeless persons unit and eventually get a safe place to live.”
15/12/08
Some more contributions from West London - and Guildford and Clapham
The following “edited” mails have been have been sent to us relating to concerns about the activities of certain groups and service structures within AA. Since we are not in a position to directly corroborate this information we welcome a response from the groups in question if they wish to challenge these assertions (or equally - information in support of these allegations). We have an open mind on the matter thus far.
However we reiterate our usual advice. Take a look for yourself and start digging below the surface:
“Monday 20.00 St Mary's Rydes Hill Community Hall, 157 Aldershot Rd, Guildford GU2 8BP
Tuesday 19.30 St Barnabas' Church, Clapham Common North Side, London SW4 9SW”
Also:
“Westway Intergroup (West London) I noticed that "the joys" are holding the service positions of Secretary, Health Liaison, Prison Liaison and Head of Region. The Prison Liaison excluded me from being involved when placing prisons secretaries at Wormwood Scrubs even though he had said he would. I raised it in front of everyone at the meeting and was closed down by the Secretary who after the meeting reminded me about "unity". The Prison Secretary effectively lied too.
Also wanted to point out on page 164 of the Big Book in the penultimate concluding paragraph of Chapter 11 - A vision for you - it says "Our book is meant to be suggestive only. We realize we know only a little. God will constantly disclose more to you and to us." This suggests to me that they expected to the fellowship to evolve in many different ways so the the argument that the "joys" present, that we must do it how it used to be, even though they're misrepresenting the old timers anyway, is fairly redundant.
All the best”
”Are you aware one of the Joy's, Michael, is heading up GSR at Westway Intergroup, London. I believe there were at least 3 other Joy's at the last meeting they might well have had a majority voting situation.
Michael used to call me when I was a struggling newcomer and say "hello this is Michael I'm supposed to call a newcomer every morning" and that was the extent of his conversation. How selfish and self-seeking is that, certainly didn't help me one iota, in fact it used to really hack me off, could easily have put me off AA altogether.
Well done for bringing this to light, they are playing with newcomers lives with their intolerance and dictatorial manner and advice on prescription drugs. I think ultimately God will take care of this but nothing wrong in giving him a hand. I like the phrase God will do for us what we can't do for ourselves BUT he won't do for us what we can.
All the best”
”They have plenty of meetings in West London and are widely talked about by AA members with either humour or annoyance but they are tolerated and left to their own devices and perhaps their own demise.
Anyone can go to their meetings knowingly, you'll become surrounded by members trying to get your number as they'll assume you're a newcomer, quite overwhelming and certainly intimidating for a shaky newcomer and largely self-seeking.
Their meetings can be deciphered in the London Where to Find by looking for the words "Road to Recovery" and or "A Vision for You" in the meetings name ie. W11 - Notting Hill: Road to recovery (a Vision for You topic) 7:30pm.
I can tell a "Joy"(also referred to by some as the "Taliban") in regular meetings a mile off by their shares which are a mere regurgitation of what they've been indoctrinated to say, they all have the same mantra, most members are aware too. Bit sad really as they're not sharing from the heart which is so liberating and powerful. Anyway just interested to see where you go with this really and no harm in providing you with a few facts from West London.
Unity, recovery, service and love”
Editor’s note: It should be remembered that meetings that bear the above titles do not necessarily form part of the cult network. Again the best way to confirm or refute our information is to go look for yourselves.
26/09/08
A contribution from South London
Quote:
"Hiya Fellas,
The Thurs Deptford meeting has only recently moved from Greenwich South Street, the meeting is locally very notorious, it has the little card for newcomers, with their suggestions upon. It was the construction of Nick F and was originally 'A Vision for You', meeting. Apparently Nick F's sponsor at Eaton square died a couple of years ago and then there was a schism as to which direction the meeting was going to take, it broke off and became known as the 'Road to Recovery'. The meeting was/is notorious for telling newcomers to stop taking prescribed medications (in contradiction of what the big book says on p.133. Also breaking Tradition 10) and of course this has resulted in the obligatory stints for new comers in locked wards etc. This was even a discussion point at an intergroup meeting of South East, East. Unsurprisingly The Road to recovery meeting was not penalised for their conduct as it still continues to this day, I have had newcomers tell me recently that they have be told to stop counselling/psychotherapy by these groups as well as stopping medication.
The Interesting thing about this meeting and especially Nick F. was that a couple of years ago he was sponsoring a couple; male and female, the said woman he was having relations with, anyway this 'spiritual giant' got pretty physically abusive with her, it got back to the group and basically it resulted in a Kangaroo court. Nick F. had to stand up at the end of a meeting and share what had happened, his infidelity, betrayal of a newcomer and physical abuse of another newcomer. Anyway this was the end of Nick F, in this meeting. The group then changed its officers and carried on its non AA approved messages and literature, I suppose it became a form of 'Diet' Road to Recovery meeting. Nick F wasn't finished, he decided to open a meeting on a Tuesday night in Greenwich at the same time as a popular & long running meeting. (The very tactic you described on your site.)
So as a result of sex & violence there became two separate manifestations of the cult one diet which is now deeply involved in organising bland social functions for South East, East Intergroup, the other a fusion of quack medicine that contradicts the AA program and domestic violence. You really couldn't make it up. I'll email you in future about the Sidcup 'Primary Purpose' groups, which I was initially involved with but pulled out of once I smelled the 'Jim Jones' scent of cult.
The Interesting thing about this meeting and especially Nick F. was that a couple of years ago he was sponsoring a couple; male and female, the said woman he was having relations with, anyway this 'spiritual giant' got pretty physically abusive with her, it got back to the group and basically it resulted in a Kangaroo court. Nick F. had to stand up at the end of a meeting and share what had happened, his infidelity, betrayal of a newcomer and physical abuse of another newcomer. Anyway this was the end of Nick F, in this meeting. The group then changed its officers and carried on its non AA approved messages and literature, I suppose it became a form of 'Diet' Road to Recovery meeting. Nick F wasn't finished, he decided to open a meeting on a Tuesday night in Greenwich at the same time as a popular & long running meeting. (The very tactic you described on your site.)
So as a result of sex & violence there became two separate manifestations of the cult one diet which is now deeply involved in organising bland social functions for South East, East Intergroup, the other a fusion of quack medicine that contradicts the AA program and domestic violence. You really couldn't make it up. I'll email you in future about the Sidcup 'Primary Purpose' groups, which I was initially involved with but pulled out of once I smelled the 'Jim Jones' scent of cult.
Keep up the good work"
01/09/08
Thanks to a contributor we have been provided with information relating to a convention being run at East London University in December by something describing itself as: “The committee of the London Primary Purpose Convention is made up of members of Alcoholics Anonymous from the North Kent and London Area.”
This convention is not to be confused with the East London “Cockney” Convention which is run by AA (East London Intergroup); the Primary Purpose convention has been organised without either the knowledge or support of that Intergroup.
The organisers claim (in a FAQ section clearly designed to deflect criticism) that the reason why Intergroup is not sponsoring this event – apart from the fact that they don’t even know about it is:
“Why is this event not sponsored by Intergroup or Region?
We did not think it would be appropriate to “risk” AA money on such a venture without any experience of its ability to self-support or not.”
Response: Surely that would be up to Intergroup to decide – not the London Primary Purpose Convention Committee
(By the way the committee members are the following: Pete, Jon, Paul, Steve, Terry)
“So you are rebels, who want to stay outside of the AA service structure?
Not at all. On the contrary all of the committee members hold service positions at either Intergroup or Region it is not our aim to be separate. It is our hope that if we show that this convention can self support over the next 2 years that it can then be absorbed into the service structure and become a regional or Intergroup event”
Response: It’s important to keep all the angles covered isn’t it? A separate non AA convention is set up as a test run in the hope that it will be adopted at a later date – so then East London will have two conventions? Or maybe just get rid of the Cockney convention and replace it with the cult approved politically correct version – the “fait accompli” tactic. It may be the case that East London Intergroup is not aware yet of the implications of having the cult operating in its area and the consequences of having cult members operating in its service structure. It will be soon.
The convention which is advertised on a website (which can be found easily enough on the internet - though we are not going to give them any publicity) and is described as the fourth of its kind in four consecutive years. Details are included on the website of dates, location, directions on how to get the venue, hotel accommodation, speakers, CD sales etc. It bears a striking resemblance to the same kind of flier that advertised the cult convention in Canterbury (see details on website). At first it might not be clear as to whether this event has any direct connection with the cult as discussed on the aacultwatch site – that is until careful inspection discloses one speaker from the 2005 convention:
Disc 6 OF 2005 CONVENTION £ 3.00 per CD
| ||||
Postage will be charged at £0.50 per CD for the first disc to the UK or £1.50 worldwide with £0.25 or £0.30 for each additional disc respectively. |
You will notice that a “Barbara K” is the speaker for Saturday Afternoon and hails from Kent UK. Now unless we are much mistaken and there are two Barbara K’s for the area then this is none other than one of our very own AA? conference delegates for South East region nominated by West Kent Intergroup. The question has to be, yet again, why is this AA conference delegate clearly supporting an event which is using the AA logo (albeit in distorted form), refers to AA members, the Big Book, recovery programme etc and yet has absolutely no contact with East London Intergroup to the extent that this AA service structure knows absolutely nothing about its running? (incidentally Barbara K was also one of the phone contacts for the Canterbury (cult) convention (run in the summer) and is also a member of the Strood (cult) group in the Medway area.
Note: the confirmed UK speakers for this year's convention and who presumably support these groups are:
Alan M
Dave M
Dee C
Ronni
Dave M
Dee C
Ronni
The site itself carries the following disclaimer:
“This site is not approved by Alcoholics Anonymous World Services, Inc, the General Service Office in the UK or any committee in the official service structure in the UK. The site is created only as a service by the group London Primary Purpose, in accordance to the 5th tradition of AA to pass on the message to the alcoholic who still suffers.”
So on the one hand it explicitly states that it, and presumably its convention therefore, are not approved by Alcoholics Anonymous and yet uses the AA logo (twisted - an apt visual symbol of their take on the programme, traditions and fellowship of AA), literature, jargon, references to the Traditions etc thereby giving every impression that it is in fact associated with AA. We would question whether East London University is aware of this distinction? Perhaps somebody should contact them on this matter?
The site also has its very own Where to Find:
They are:
Altered Attitudes
Goodmayes Lane
Goodmayes
Venue: All Saints Church
County: London
Postal Code: IG3
Day: Tuesday
Sidcup Into Action
Hadlow Road
Sidcup
Hadlow Road
Sidcup
Venue: The Emmanuel Methodist Church
County: Kent
Postal Code: ?
Day: Sunday
Sidcup Into Action
Hadlow Road
Sidcup
Hadlow Road
Sidcup
Venue: The Emmanuel Methodist Church
County: Kent
Postal Code: ?
Day: Thursday
The Barking Big Book Study "The Way Out"
Morley Road Entrance, Movers Lane
Barking
Morley Road Entrance, Movers Lane
Barking
Venue: Salvation Army Church
County: London
Postal Code: IG11
Day: Saturday
Various other groups are referred to in this section – including two groups in Purley, one in Enfield, one in Cambridge and a few others in other parts of the country. It should be emphasised that AA groups in these areas (or anywhere else for that matter) are not listed. The Goodmayes and Barking groups are both labelled the “Taliban” locally reflecting their extremist, dogmatic, exploitative and oppressive methods. The two Sidcup groups are similarly well known in their area for the same reasons.
It would seem therefore to us that even if the Primary Purpose groups are not necessarily connected directly with the cult groups described elsewhere on the cultwatch website they seem to be swapping personnel and methods, and perhaps it is the case that there are more similarities than differences.
The site carries on in the “Who We Are” section:
“At the convention in December and during the planning we were heartened by the amount of people around the country who were trying to carry the message from the big book in AA. It was also apparent that often such folk were isolated and were experiencing difficulties. Post convention the committee met and agreed to expand the purpose and function of this website. It is our hope that it will provide a useful resource for like minded people to be able to share ideas and experience and be able to find the fellowship they crave.”
It is clear from this that this grouping seems to believe that only a minority of people are carrying the AA message in this country – well we’d probably have to agree with that – the Big Book AA message that they claim to carry is certainly not contained in any of the editions that we have access to so it’s hardly surprising that AA members are not using it; perhaps they have discovered the legendary esoteric teachings of Bill W et al that have not yet been revealed to us lesser mortals (irony intended!). So again it is the case that we have all got it wrong – ie AA – and they are the only ones who’ve got it right – cult.
We now come to the double think part of the site or what they call FAQs.
Firstly:
“Is it true that you guys are in violation of the 4th tradition by putting up this website?
We don’t think so. We are not affiliated with anything else other than Alcoholics Anonymous and cannot see how the content of this website can “greatly injure AA as a whole” (12 and 12 p.151). After all the main aim of this website is to promote the use of the book Alcoholics Anonymous from which the fellowship took its name. We are keen as a group to adhere to the traditions but do not, however, hold ourselves up as experts in such matters. If you have information that shows our interpretation is wrong then please forward it to us.”
Response: That’s a convenient attack of humility. We refer you to your disclaimer above. Are you affiliated or not – or only when it suits you to use the AA name for your own purposes? As for the claim that you seek to promote the use of the Big Book – we refer you to our comments above – which version would that be - AA’s or yours? (By the way we do not believe for an instant that if someone did point out to you the glaring and obvious breaches of the Traditions you would pay the slightest attention).
“What about the first tradition and AA unity?
We are committed members of Alcoholics Anonymous. The groups on these pages are all AA groups and a part of the official service structure, to our knowledge, they hold no other affiliation. We have no plans to write our own book, start our own phone service or to build a chain of hospitals. The website is a tool for those who want to use it nothing more and nothing less.”
Response: If you have a desire to stop drinking that would make you members of AA. However the groups that are referred to in your Where to Find seem to have two affiliations – one to AA and one to the Primary Purpose groups – it is our view that the Primary Purpose groups do not abide by the traditions, do not carry the AA message and therefore have no respect for the AA fellowship at all. Your perverse reinterpretation of the Big Book is more than sufficient to qualify as rewriting it. The two Sidcup groups are directly involved in two treatment centres and actively recruit newcomers for their own meetings and equally seek to discourage newcomers from attending legitimate AA meetings (as do all the cult groups). The website is nothing other than a tool for promoting your convention (and dubious message) and is intended to create disunity in AA (to your advantage). It seems clear that you have absolutely no commitment to AA but only to your own agenda.
“Are you trying to create a fellowship within the fellowship?
Ummm…. Well… yes. Probably. Let us explain. We do not believe we have the power to “create” anything this website is more of a recognition that such a fellowship already exists. It is a fact that there are groups of people in AA who believe in the message of the Big Book and there are those that don’t. We as a group have no opinion on how any individual chooses to recover or not - we aim just to provide a service to those who choose to use it.
It is a natural fact of life that people who have similar experiences, beliefs and interests will want to be in each others company as they have more in common. This seems to be as true in AA as in any other area of life.”
Response: Ummm… Well… yes. What a mealy mouthed answer – but typical! But straight from the horse’s …. So the defence is: we didn’t cause this disunity – but we’re sure as hell going to capitalise on it. It’s the usual mantra “We’re right and you’re ALL wrong”. But here’s a strange thing – the Big Book seems to be on sale at pretty well all the AA meetings we go to. Nobody’s forced not to read it – but then again AA runs on suggestions – not dogma. The real problem is that the cult groups don’t like freedom of choice – it just isn’t tidy having all these alcoholics running around making their own decisions. God forbid!
“Are you them Step Nazi’s or the AA Taliban that I have heard about?
Yes we are. Many of us have been called such names, usually behind our backs. However, we believe these statements say more about those that say them than they do about us. After all is it really possible to compare a bunch of Alcoholics who talk about finding a loving God through working the 12 Steps with dictatorships that have been responsible for the deaths, torture and suffering of millions?
We do not think that the people who make such statements are deliberately trying to belittle the experiences of the people or their families who suffered under such regimes. Instead, maybe, just trying to highlight their own disliking of the more structured approach our meetings take in comparison to others in AA.
So if others are using the term Step Nazi to describe someone who passionately believes in the recovery process outlined in the Big Book then yes that is us.”
Response: for “a loving God” read “as we dictate it to you”; for “structured approach” read “dogma and control – do exactly what your sponsor tells you”; for “passionately believes” read “fanatical”; and as for “recovery process outlined in the Big Book” perhaps it would be a good idea if you actually read the book in question – especially Working With Others. Perhaps the use of the terms "Nazi" and "Taliban" refer more to a fundamental abhorrence of tyranny in no matter what forms it may exhibit itself. Propagandists are a necessary adjunct to any attempt to pervert the truth - and the cult and Primary Purpose groups are no exception.
Finally we have passed all this information on to East London Intergroup as well as publishing it on the site. So secrecy is no longer optional!
Cheers
The Fellas
Coming shortly – a critique of the cult and Primary Purpose movements’ flawed fundamental premiss
18/05/08
London area: another newcomer suicide
We have received reports from the London area (from identifiable sources but as yet uncorroborated - so any further information on these – and other incidents – would be welcome) of still more casualties due to the cult dogma in relation to their misdirection (contrary to AA guidelines) on medication issues. Three separate incidents are described all of which are explicitly related to the activities of the “Visions” cult. The first relates to a woman newcomer who had the misfortune to encounter them. She was advised to discontinue her medication on the grounds that if she did not do so she could not have a sponsor or do the Steps. As a direct result of her following this direction her condition deteriorated and medical intervention was required to ensure that she did not do herself harm.
In another reported incident a male newcomer had been advised by his GP to undergo a medically supervised detox since to stop drinking otherwise might be dangerous. This advice was contradicted by cult ‘professionals’ and as a result of their directions the man suffered an alcoholic fit which resulted in him sustaining potentially life-threatening injuries.
Finally, and most seriously, another newcomer was given the same irresponsible direction, told he was not doing “it” right, ceased to take his medication and committed suicide.
It remains the case that newcomers to AA who encounter the cult are still being fed a version of the programme which is nothing short of a complete perversion of AA’s message and principles. The suffering that results from this advice is completely unnecessary and in every case tragic.
Members of AA who are dual diagnosis are having not only to deal with the trauma of stopping drinking (which as we all know is a mountainous climb in itself) but also have to undergo the pressure being placed upon them by individuals who know full well that they are not qualified or, in most cases, have no direct experience of these conditions, and yet persist in giving instruction which has such devastating consequences for those on the receiving end of their ‘expertise’.
This problem will not just go away. The Trustees, the General Service Office and the AA Conference are not going to be able to deal with this. They have no real power and can only reiterate the guidelines which already exist with reference to AA policy on the medication issue. The responsibility for tackling these issues lies with the membership of AA – that means you! Every member of AA who fails to act, to intervene, to challenge the activities of these individuals and groups is complicit in their conduct; looking the other way makes a mockery of the AA pledge and pretending that the problem does not exist results in real suffering for the newcomer – the very people that we are supposed to be helping.
If this makes you feel uncomfortable that’s tough!
Because it’s a whole lot more unpleasant for those who are under fire from the cult fanatics and who are least able to fend off their dangerous ‘suggestions’.
We would suggest that any member who has suffered as a result of the cult’s activities send a written report detailing the incident to:
Trustees of the General Service Board of Alcoholics Anonymous,
c/o Alcoholics Anonymous
PO Box 1
10 Toft Green
York YO1 7ND.
This will not necessarily result in any action but there will at least be a written record on file. Additionally individuals may choose to bring the activities of the cult, its individual members and groups, to the attention of the local health authority, your GP and any other health professional involved so that they are fully informed of the potential risks to their clients by referring these to AA. If AA wishes to work with outside organisations then it has an ethical responsibility to ensure that all these organisations are fully informed of the implications of referring their clients to our Fellowship.
We also suggest that you send a written report (either directly or via your home group) to your local intergroup. Again they may not be able to take any action but at least they cannot claim they were never told! The biggest ally of the cult is secrecy (posing under the guise of anonymity). Exposure is the last thing they want for they cannot afford to have their activities and agenda brought under the scrutiny of the Fellowship as a whole.
Finally, although it is questionable whether a civil action for negligence would succeed (see site: Duty of Care) it might be worth considering in the more serious cases where an individual has suffered severe harm, getting legal advice on the matter to determine whether a test case might succeed. We live in an increasingly litigious society and it is not a trend that is particularly attractive but if it results in future lives being preserved then it may well be a price worth paying.
For our part we will continue our campaign to expose the activities of the cult, its groups and members, until our aims have been achieved.
The Fellas
London area: another newcomer suicide
We have received reports from the London area (from identifiable sources but as yet uncorroborated - so any further information on these – and other incidents – would be welcome) of still more casualties due to the cult dogma in relation to their misdirection (contrary to AA guidelines) on medication issues. Three separate incidents are described all of which are explicitly related to the activities of the “Visions” cult. The first relates to a woman newcomer who had the misfortune to encounter them. She was advised to discontinue her medication on the grounds that if she did not do so she could not have a sponsor or do the Steps. As a direct result of her following this direction her condition deteriorated and medical intervention was required to ensure that she did not do herself harm.
In another reported incident a male newcomer had been advised by his GP to undergo a medically supervised detox since to stop drinking otherwise might be dangerous. This advice was contradicted by cult ‘professionals’ and as a result of their directions the man suffered an alcoholic fit which resulted in him sustaining potentially life-threatening injuries.
Finally, and most seriously, another newcomer was given the same irresponsible direction, told he was not doing “it” right, ceased to take his medication and committed suicide.
It remains the case that newcomers to AA who encounter the cult are still being fed a version of the programme which is nothing short of a complete perversion of AA’s message and principles. The suffering that results from this advice is completely unnecessary and in every case tragic.
Members of AA who are dual diagnosis are having not only to deal with the trauma of stopping drinking (which as we all know is a mountainous climb in itself) but also have to undergo the pressure being placed upon them by individuals who know full well that they are not qualified or, in most cases, have no direct experience of these conditions, and yet persist in giving instruction which has such devastating consequences for those on the receiving end of their ‘expertise’.
This problem will not just go away. The Trustees, the General Service Office and the AA Conference are not going to be able to deal with this. They have no real power and can only reiterate the guidelines which already exist with reference to AA policy on the medication issue. The responsibility for tackling these issues lies with the membership of AA – that means you! Every member of AA who fails to act, to intervene, to challenge the activities of these individuals and groups is complicit in their conduct; looking the other way makes a mockery of the AA pledge and pretending that the problem does not exist results in real suffering for the newcomer – the very people that we are supposed to be helping.
If this makes you feel uncomfortable that’s tough!
Because it’s a whole lot more unpleasant for those who are under fire from the cult fanatics and who are least able to fend off their dangerous ‘suggestions’.
We would suggest that any member who has suffered as a result of the cult’s activities send a written report detailing the incident to:
Trustees of the General Service Board of Alcoholics Anonymous,
c/o Alcoholics Anonymous
PO Box 1
10 Toft Green
York YO1 7ND.
This will not necessarily result in any action but there will at least be a written record on file. Additionally individuals may choose to bring the activities of the cult, its individual members and groups, to the attention of the local health authority, your GP and any other health professional involved so that they are fully informed of the potential risks to their clients by referring these to AA. If AA wishes to work with outside organisations then it has an ethical responsibility to ensure that all these organisations are fully informed of the implications of referring their clients to our Fellowship.
We also suggest that you send a written report (either directly or via your home group) to your local intergroup. Again they may not be able to take any action but at least they cannot claim they were never told! The biggest ally of the cult is secrecy (posing under the guise of anonymity). Exposure is the last thing they want for they cannot afford to have their activities and agenda brought under the scrutiny of the Fellowship as a whole.
Finally, although it is questionable whether a civil action for negligence would succeed (see site: Duty of Care) it might be worth considering in the more serious cases where an individual has suffered severe harm, getting legal advice on the matter to determine whether a test case might succeed. We live in an increasingly litigious society and it is not a trend that is particularly attractive but if it results in future lives being preserved then it may well be a price worth paying.
For our part we will continue our campaign to expose the activities of the cult, its groups and members, until our aims have been achieved.
The Fellas
14/01/08
News from London South East (East)
Sorry about the break in transmission - nothing serious - or sinister - simple laziness. Well WKIG meeting has come and gone - anyone notice?? - still it seems that the chairman has figured out how to use a calculator and has done some sums - and shock horror - the cult groups are grossly over-represented on the intergroup - somebody must have been keeping it a secret from him - what a surprise we say!! But it's not so much what happens at the intergroup meeting (which let's face it isn't a great deal) that has any significance - it's what is going on behind the scenes - but more of that at another time - suffice to say that democracy is comparable to a dead parrot in West Kent - well and truly fallen from its perch - AA run by its membership - we don't think so. So moving on rapidly some news from South East London (East) intergroup:
Firstly as always we would refer you to our overview section and references to profiling of the cult groups. The final judgement as to whether a group displays these characteristics must be up to each individual to decide upon for him- or herself. However a member from South East London (East) has indicated that the following groups display the hallmarks of a cult group. They are:-
Greenwich: Tuesday
Deptford: Sunday
Deptford: Thursday
Bexley Heath: Monday
North Kent:
Sidcup: Thursday
Sidcup: Sunday
Additionally it has been indicated that they may have some impact on:-
News from London South East (East)
Sorry about the break in transmission - nothing serious - or sinister - simple laziness. Well WKIG meeting has come and gone - anyone notice?? - still it seems that the chairman has figured out how to use a calculator and has done some sums - and shock horror - the cult groups are grossly over-represented on the intergroup - somebody must have been keeping it a secret from him - what a surprise we say!! But it's not so much what happens at the intergroup meeting (which let's face it isn't a great deal) that has any significance - it's what is going on behind the scenes - but more of that at another time - suffice to say that democracy is comparable to a dead parrot in West Kent - well and truly fallen from its perch - AA run by its membership - we don't think so. So moving on rapidly some news from South East London (East) intergroup:
Firstly as always we would refer you to our overview section and references to profiling of the cult groups. The final judgement as to whether a group displays these characteristics must be up to each individual to decide upon for him- or herself. However a member from South East London (East) has indicated that the following groups display the hallmarks of a cult group. They are:-
Greenwich: Tuesday
Deptford: Sunday
Deptford: Thursday
Bexley Heath: Monday
North Kent:
Sidcup: Thursday
Sidcup: Sunday
Additionally it has been indicated that they may have some impact on:-
Welling: Wed night
Eltham: Sunday lunchtime
Any further information on these (or any other groups) that seem to be seriously breaching AA Traditions may be sent to the site via the email address.
22/12/07
The cult’s perversion of Step Four – a contribution sent from North East London Intergroup
Chronology of events regarding distribution of non-AA literature at Highbury Beginners
The cult’s perversion of Step Four – a contribution sent from North East London Intergroup
Chronology of events regarding distribution of non-AA literature at Highbury Beginners
A member brought it to the attention of Intergroup that non-AA literature was being circulated at an AA meeting in Highbury as they felt its content was inappropriate.
These photocopied sheets were brought to the next Intergroup meeting for discussion. As Chair, I read out the document. Attendees at the meeting were shocked and upset by the following content:
“Sexual Conduct
In heterosexual sex, even if contraceptives are used, there is the possibility of the creation of life. If we have not considered that possibility by having a family in place to receive that potential baby (ie a stable, permanent relationship) then, again, it is selfish …. In the inventory we should be prepared to include sex with men, women, children, animals… and bottles. Sometimes the exact nature of the sexual act (particular positions indulged in, for example) should go down if the motive indulged in it is primarily selfish gratification rather than expression of love. Similarly, we should include details of our darkest sexual fantasies and the precise details about them that twinge our consciences, which are usually the most embarrassing details. In these cases, “I fantasise about having sex with XX” is not enough. We need the very detail that we are reluctant to tell others; that would make it embarrassing, for example, to have on the front page of a newspaper; or that perhaps we would least like to describe to our mothers (hypothetically!).”
The conscience of the Intergroup was to encourage the GSR of the Highbury meeting to come along to the next Intergroup meeting to shed some light on this situation.
The next Intergroup meeting the GSR did not turn up.
With the agreement of the Intergroup I went to the Highbury meeting to have an informal chat with the GSR to relay the unease felt at Intergroup and to get some feedback.
This I did and spoke privately with the GSR. I relayed the issues felt by the Intergroup. [see “Dear K” letter below for synopsis of the conversation]. The conversation was very calm and friendly – the GSR is a member I have known for some time through doing service. The issues that I spoke about I had written down for him so that everything remained clear. They were:
· The literature was not AA approved, was felt to be offensive, shaming and contained opinions unconnected to alcoholism, Alcoholics Anonymous and so breached Tradition Ten.
· The distribution of reproduced passages of the Big Book may break copywrite law.
· Having such papers distributed at a ‘beginners’ meeting was thought to be a clear breach of Tradition Four: The group’s assumption of autonomy negated due to the fact that it was felt the fellowship as a whole could be affected, as the document – its judgements and opinions – is not reflective of the program of Alcoholics Anonymous.
I encouraged the GSR again to shed some light on this at the next Intergroup. In the meantime the Telephone Reps were unsure as to whether the meeting could still call itself an Alcoholics Anonymous meeting (as opposed to a ‘recovery group’) and red-spotted (a sign of a temporary change) the meeting in the WTF that the phone volunteers use to direct newcomers to meetings.
During our discussion, the Highbury Beginners GSR expressed his personal unease with the meeting but would bring these issues to their next group conscience. We agreed to see each other at the next Intergroup meeting.
Shortly before the next Intergroup meeting I received a phone call from the Highbury Beginner’s GSR to say he had stepped down from his post and was no longer involved in the Group and that the Highbury meeting had dissolved.
The next Intergroup meeting, one of the founders of Highbury Beginners attended Intergroup and in Group Reports he reported that the Highbury meeting was no longer running and that the photocopied sheets that were distributed were a mistake by the secretary. When asked about the group’s online link to an electronic version of the document, http://…….. which links to http://……. (concern as to the connection to the online document had been expressed as it places AA nationally in a position of concern both legally and traditions-wise) no explanation was given. The attending member was thanked for taking the time to attend Intergroup. [The document as it appears online has since been edited. R. 2007]
The end – until Region meeting on 4th March 2007
No issue was ever brought to Intergroup about a Tottenham meeting.
This is the chronology of events. I am left baffled by a Conference Delegate’s personal attack during his report at Region on 4th March 2007 (‘personal’ as I was mentioned by name). It seemed to be a vague response to my reading of the Concepts at the start of the meeting and regarding the actions and report of a Telephone Liaison Officer.
Yours in Fellowship,
R
NELIG Chair.
Letter to K, GSR Highbury Beginners.
At the NELIG meeting on Thursday 28th September 2006 a complaint was discussed about literature being circulated at Highbury Beginners meeting on a Friday evening.
The literature is not AA approved and the contents of which was found to be of an offensive nature, contained opinions of issues unconnected to alcoholism (breaching Tradition Ten) and the distribution of reproductions of passages of the Big Book is thought to break copywrite law. The matter was discussed at length and the conscience of the Intergroup was that having such information circulated at AA meetings was a clear breach of Tradition Four as this kind of activity affects AA as a whole. This negates the group's assumption of autonomy. As it contravenes the Fourth Tradition, the action to be taken was voted on and follows:
We request that your GSR [or another representative], attend the next NELIG meeting to provide further details about the literature which is available at the Highbury Beginners meeting on a Friday. If you fail to attend the Intergroup meeting, or you attend but fail to reassure the Intergroup on the subject of this literature, Intergroup will have no option but to remove you as an officer of the Intergroup and together with the telephone committee, take steps to remove your meeting from the Where To Find.
In the meantime and after further discussion and voting on this matter at the Telephone Reps meeting yesterday the Highbury Beginners has been ‘red-spotted’ in the meeting directory at the Southern Service Office.
The next NELIG meeting is on Thursday 30th November at 8pm and the SSO, Cynthia Street.
Look forward to discussing this further.
Regards
R, NELIG Chair.
[Originals on file]
Editor’s comment:
The selected passage refers to the website authors’ interpretation of the sex conduct section of the Step Four inventory. This perverse view bears no resemblance whatsoever to anything described in the Big Book with reference to this part of the Step. It is to be questioned what possible purpose could be served by this prurient investigation into the sexual activities and imaginings of AA members other than to satiate the voyeuristic tendencies of the listener clearly displayed in this particular outline. It is also quite clear that the authors of these guidelines can have given little thought to the potential psychological and criminal implications of their approach. The fact that members might give an account of some aspect of sexual experience to someone with absolutely no training in dealing with the impact of such revelations hardly bears thinking about - both in terms of the consequences for the person undergoing the step and for their auditor. Furthermore the writers seem not to have considered the possibility that such admissions may render both members liable to prosecution; one as the perpetrator of the illegal act and the second as an accessory if they fail to report the offence.
Less seriously a number of assumptions are made with reference to moral judgements with respect to sexual activity and procreation; whether one agrees with these views or not is beside the point. They are not representative of the guidance expressed in AA literature and yet they are presented predominantly to newcomers as if they were part of AA philosophy.
The content of this extract (and of the rest of the Step) and the information from NELIG yet again exhibit all the characteristics of the cult’s strategies in seeking to subvert mainstream AA: their continued dissemination of non-AA literature within meetings without making it explicit that this material does not represent AA’s principles; their complete disregard for AA Traditions; their targeting of newcomers in whom they seek to implant their own sick version of the recovery programme; their tactics of evasion and dishonesty when called upon to account for their irresponsible conduct (the Highbury meeting had closed down only to open in another location); their controlling techniques and elevation of the sponsor to the position of Higher Power (although they do allow that there is a Higher Power it is made clear in their literature that for all practical purposes newcomers should seek advice and direction on effectively everything on a day-by-day basis – to be precise and to quote from one of the web sites referred to in the above communication: “do exactly what your sponsor tells you”).
Incidentally it is interesting to note that of the two websites referred to in the communication (whose names have been omitted) one of them is registered under the same surname as a certain David C, erstwhile chairman of London Region – we assume that this must just be one of those coincidences.
Postscript: Although the offensive section has been removed from the website content it is unclear whether these sections have been removed from usage within the cult groups. We have received copies of this Step currently in use by the cult in East Kent which suggest that there still remains the ‘voyeuristic’ element in the methods advocated by these groups but that the more extreme perversions have been removed.
28/09/07
The Borg move on North London Region
Our contact in the wild, wild West – the even wilder Wild Bill Hickcock (no don’t look for clues in the name – it will avail you nothing) tell us that the cult are working away at assimilating North London into the collective. [Note: we have become increasingly bored with the frequent use of the word “cult. We often use the word “cult” because that particular word, “cult” most accurately describes the “cult-like” activities of our own particular brand of “cult”. The “cult” (where we continue to refer to them in this way, that is using the term “cult”) really, really doesn’t like being called a “cult”. They dislike the term “cult” because it reminds them of what they are, ie a “cult” and who likes to hear a hard truth – well not a “cult” that’s for sure – and we use the term “cult” because we prefer to tell the truth about the “cult” and because it annoys the “cult” so much]. So….
…. even we have to acknowledge that the use of the word “cult” does become tiresome after a while so we’ve decided to change tack and refrain from using the word “cult” for the purpose of this article and switch from “cult” to “the Borg” or “Borg” for Star Trek purists. For those of you who are not fans of the series the Borg were a species of cyborg - part biological/part machine, whose sole aim was the assimilation (physical, psychological and quite possibly spiritual) of all other species into their own via a rather gruesome process. Opposition was not tolerated and "resistance is futile" seemed to be the mantra they invoked. Everything and everyone had to acknowledge their superiority and they swept all aside with contemptuous ease (if they had been capable of the emotion); we shall leave you with that image.
Now getting back to the Borg. They have been beavering away in North London region (the biggest region of the country) gradually establishing what they hope to be a complete stranglehold of the entire area. So far their grasp is tenuous but just give them a bit more time. They’ve managed to establish their base via a simple and clever manoeuvre disguised as "democracy" -- they got Region to vote 3 years ago for an annual combined meeting of GSRs in all eleven intergroups, to take place on the first Sunday in November and "confirm" Region officers and Conference Delegates. The second year this "Region Assembly" voted itself the power to declare Region policies... last year they voted for their intergroups to send their money to region rather than GSO... and next month they've got resolutions about taking over the London Where To Find and filling it with their literature. Now, there are 450 meetings in these eleven intergroups and about half of them have GSRs, but of course most of the active ones attend their intergroups for Service matters, thus only 40-50 diehards show up at this Assembly. Guess how many Visionary (also known as the “cult” or the Borg) GSRs are three-line-whipped into going and voting as a bloc? About 30. This is the Fellowship of AA in a nutshell. You only have to organise between five and ten percent of members at any level to control that level.... which is OK if you're picking a tea maker for your group, but dangerous when the decision is whether a meetings-list for newcomers should include instructions to drunken members of the public to get down on their knees…
We think that you get the picture – the “cult” - sorrrrrrryyyyy – shouldn’t use the word “cult” because we decided, didn’t we, that “cult” was getting a bit excessively used so we must stop using that word “cult” and get back to “the Borg”. So the Borg are setting up their own regional meetings, filling them with their members and thereby controlling Regional decisions thereby bypassing inconvenient structures like regular Regional meetings. Personally we prefer the Borgs’ original tactics from the series – they would just stick those funny prongy things into your neck and bob’s your uncle, you’re assimilated – a much less painful and long-drawn out process than that employed by the present crop of hostile aliens.
Now surely you are wondering – what to do? How shall we tackle this dreadful and apparently irresistible force from the Delta Quadrant? Surely Captain Jean Luc Picard and his intrepid crew will warp in from nowhere and contemptuously thrust aside these parasitic predators. Don’t be silly! None of that was real. It was all make- believe. It was all fictional. Couldn’t you tell from all those daft scenes where the entire crew on the bridge of the good old Starship Enterprise would enthusiastically throw themselves about as yet another disruptor blast or photon torpedo would hit the deflector shields – they never got it quite right did they! No. We’re terribly sorry to tell you this but the only people who are going to sort this one out are you. Not even the team from the Starship www.aacultwatch are going to be able to help you on this one. Here’s an idea though:
First tell everyone about www.aacultwatch.co.uk. It saves time in explaining what's going on. Send in your own contributions of encounters with the dark forces. Then maybe the GSRs from the non-Borg groups can get together and do exactly the same thing. If your group hasn’t got a GSR then find one – or get someone to stand in. Start chatting to each other and decide what you are going to do. Then go and do it. One place to start would be this Borg controlled Region Assembly – go along and make sure that there are more of you than the Borg – always a good ploy – and since there are already more of you than the Borg that shouldn’t be a problem. Vote against anything that they vote for – you can be sure that whatever they vote for won’t be for the good of AA. Then maybe you should vote this assembly out of existence and get control of region back to???? REGION. Then keep on doing this stuff on every occasion that presents itself – and hey presto – the Borg will retreat in disarray. But remember – they will always be there – just waiting for the chance to ASSIMILATE?
Live long and prosper
The Good Fellas
